MINISTER COUGHLAN’S RESPONSE TO A REQUEST FOR A POLL ON TRUST FUND
Thank you for your recent email in relation to the proposed establishment of a Statutory Fund to meet the needs of survivors going forward.
I wish to advise you that, in the period following the publication of the Ryan Report, a motion was passed in the Dail on the 28th May 2009 calling on the congregations to commit to making further substantial contributions by way of reparation, in the context of discussions with the State, including to a Fund to be set up and managed by the State for the support of victims and to other education and welfare purposes. In addition to the original €128m contribution under the 2002 Indemnity Agreement, the Congregations are now offering significant additional contributions, which they have valued at €348.51m.
The Government announced its proposal to utilise the cash element of the Congregations’ current offers of contributions, which will amount to some €110m over the next few years, to establish a Statutory Fund, in keeping with the all party Motion passed by Dáil Éireann, supporting the proposal for a Trust for the support of victims and to other education and welfare purposes. Following consultation with the Congregations and the former residents as to the exact nature of the fund, how it will operate and the uses to which it will be put, the arrangements for the Statutory Fund will be considered by the Government. This Fund, which will be to support the needs of survivors, is separate and distinct from the compensation scheme operated by the independent Residential Institutions Redress Board, which provides fair and reasonable awards to victims of institutional childhood abuse. In a statement issue on 15th April last, the Government indicated that it was satisfied that the arrangements put in place have benefited survivors and it does not propose to revise the arrangements.
In terms of seeking the views of all former residents, particularly those not affiliated to any group, I can tell you that, owing to the confidential nature of the information supplied to the Residential Institutions Redress Board, the Government does not have access to the names or contact details of individuals who may have applied to the Board. However, the Government considers it appropriate to attempt to seek the views of all those wishing to contribute to this process and is currently considering how to put in place an appropriate mechanism by which the views of individuals can be conveyed.
I hope this information is of assistance to you.
Kind regards
Yours sincerely
Mary Coughlan TD
Tánaiste & Minister for Education & Skills
€34m for groups supporting institutional abuse survivors
By Conall Ó Fátharta
MONDAY, DECEMBER 06, 2010
AN estimated €34 million has been provided to groups supporting victims of institutional abuse between 2001 and 2009
The latest report by the Comptroller and Auditor General, on the Department of Education and Skills, found that a total of 11 survivor groups (six based in Ireland and five in Britain) have received funding in this period.
Between 2001 and 2009, the Department of Education provided €11.6m to “support groups in the provision of an information and referral service”.
A further €16.7m was provided by the HSE to provide a range of services including payment of rent, associated office costs and a contribution towards the provision of an outreach centre.
The Department of Health contributed €4.3m to provide “outreach services in Britain, funding towards counselling referrals and support services and office and accommodation costs.” The remainder of the funding came from the Department of Environment and the Department of Foreign Affairs.
The report highlighted that the further funding of one group, in particular, was being examined.
“In the light of a recent HSE report, which found inadequacies in governance arrangements in one group, the department is consulting with the HSE in light of the findings and further funding of the organisation is dependent on a satisfactory outcome to this process,” said the report.
The report also made a recommendation that the effectiveness of certain aspects of the outreach and support provided to survivor groups should be examined.
“At a suitable juncture, it would be useful to examine the effectiveness of outreach and support provided to survivor groups,” the report concluded.
The likely cost of the redress scheme for victims of abuse in residential institutions in now put at €1.1 billion. The bulk of the contribution of religious congregations agreed with the state has been provided by way of cash or property.
While final title to 28 properties is still being established, the transferees are in possession of them and all but seven properties have been brought into use.
This story appeared in the printed version of the Irish Examiner Monday, December 06, 2010
Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/34m-for-groups-supporting-institutional-abuse-survivors-138562.html#ixzz17JUti7PG
Two abuse survivor groups ask PAC to investigate Cork-based charity
By Jennifer Hough
MONDAY, NOVEMBER 22, 2010
THE Public Accounts Committee (PAC) has received two separate requests to investigate a Cork-based charity for survivors of institutional abuse.
Tom Hayes of the Alliance survivor group and Patrick Walsh of SOCA [survivors of child abuse] recently wrote to the PAC raising concerns about Right of Place, an organisation which has received at least €2.4 million from the HSE since 2002, a further €1m from the Department of Education and funds from the National Lottery.
“We as a group have raised these concerns with the Department of Education and Skills and with the Residential Institutions Redress Unit in Athlone over many years,” Mr Hayes wrote to Bernard Allen, chairman of the committee.
“Indeed, the Alliance wrote to every councillor in Cork and asked that they please look again at the facilities in Lower Glanmire Road called Right of Place. We emailed the mayor also and asked that he withdraws the facilities at that address because of our concerns.”
Mr Walsh said SOCA and others had for “many years” been complaining about the “extraordinary conduct” of the group. Mr Walsh said nothing short of a full inquiry would suffice.
In a separate letter to HSE manager David Gaskin, who has sanctioned funding to Right of Place over the years, Mr Hayes asked why he was continuing to allow the “debacle” to continue.
“We have tried to raise the difficulties that we and other survivors were having because of your failures, we wrote to you and informed you of these, we visited Cork and held meetings with former residents to properly inform ourselves of the situation and then contacted you again, without any acknowledgement from you and others responsible for regulating or holding to account those responsible for the day to day running of Right of Place,” he wrote.
“You have done a great disservice to survivors. You have compounded this by your complete failure to act in a credible way with any integrity.”
The PAC said it had referred the matter to the HSE and the Department of Education for notes.
Meanwhile although Right of Place, founded by former Upton resident Noel Barry, claims to have 1,500 members, and has received funding on this basis, it is understood there may be far less than that.
Another former Upton resident living in Britain contacted the Irish Examiner saying he was a member of this group up to about a year ago.
“I notified Noel Barry that I wished my name to be removed from their databank. I never received a reply. Last week I received a letter from a Mr Michael Walsh, addressed to me as ‘Dear Member’, and which poses a few questions from me – just where did he get my address and details, and it would appear that his new group is simply taking over from where the old group left off. They will carry on receiving funding from the HSE, on the back of members they claim to represent, but it is so wrong, as they were never mandated to do this, and I certainly did not request them to represent me.”
This story appeared in the printed version of the Irish Examiner Monday, November 22, 2010
Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/two-abuse-survivor-groups-ask-pac-to-investigate-cork-based-charity-137175.html#ixzz15zaXhdUl
http://www.petitions.ie/Statutory
Don’t know why the link wasnt posted?
This is the link
To Vote on the Stautory Trust Fund
Members of ShameOfIreland need to vote again as this is a seperate count.
ShameOfIreland is the only place at present where you can give Paddy a ROLLING, EASILY REAFFIRMED MANDATE. If it is called into question by anyone.
I urge you all to join?
NEW PETITION
We the undersigned Petition to get the Statutory Trust Fund dissolved and the Money Paid to the Victims.
As you are aware the Trust Fund is to become Law and many Survivors do not wish this to happen!
The Irish Government is going ahead regardless; there is also a “rumour” that the Trust Fund will replace the Education Fund making it a “Zero” advance in the Support of “Victims of the Industrial Schools
This Heinous Trust Becomes Law in September!
WE ARE RUNNING OUT OF TIME!
To nominate and vote for Representatives for Survivors
Join
ShameOfIreland
Yahoo ID required; (very easy to set up!)
If you are sick and tired of the People who claim to represent you?
Mary Coughlan ,Convent educated ,Straight into Uni, Straight into Politics, I say to her She Mary Coughlan is the very reason those Of her ILK is the reason Irish People are scattered all over the world. She is not well liked from what I have read of her in Newspapers ,>Type in her name .If she goes ahead with keeping our compansation after holding secret meetings It will Come back on her in a big way .She is going against our human rights. She is a cold hard woman just like our abusers .
Hi. Paddy.
I have set up a Email address irishsurvivors@hotmail.com i would like to find out how many survivors and supporters would be willing to attend a demonstration in London later this year during the Popes visit against the trust fund.
I will post results on your site if that is ok. Lets see what happens.
Paul Nolan.
I have registered my vote against the trust fund.
Correct me if I am wrong but the Statutory Trust Fund will become Law in September 2010; after reading the Bill in the Irish Parliament?
Also I was under the impression that he money and assets from C.O.R.I. was for compensation to the Victims not to reimburse the Government?
Web links would be useful to rob.northall@ntlworld.com
I would also like to add if this fund goes ahead it will be a free get out of jail card for the Churches. They will hold on to property and monies promised to victims of abuse. It will take years to get these funds from them and i suspect the Irish goverment will be slow to chase them for these funds.
PLEASE VOTE (EVERYONE COUNTS)
Paul Nolan.
I have recorded my vote against the trust fund.
If we all register a vote it may make a difference,
Lord knows we need to be heard. PLEASE VOTE.
Paul Nolan.
Thank you Rob will try later.Catherine
Dear Catherine and anyone else getting the same problem; I clicked on the link to ShameOfIreland at Yahoogroups on this page and it opened in outlook express have just tested it again the message is there.
Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the
ShameOfIreland group:
The Statutory Trust Fund should be dissolved and the Money Paid to the Victims
o YES
o NO
my email is rob.northall@ntlworld.com email me and I will send you the link to the poll
The Spam guard on this site doesn’t like the weblink I pasted
Hope this helps
Rob tried to send an e-mail to ShameofIreland it was unsuccessful.
Sorry if my first message was somewhat disjointed but we have all typed badly when a bit worked up; my mind was thinking about the unanswered letter to Brian Cowen asking him to sue the Pope.
Theb Yahoo Group has a draft Aim and Objectives and a membership of one – ME!
I have an idea but I need another 3,999 members to make them take notice.
It will take 10 minutes of your time!
Once we have a core membership of 100 we can vote on the aims and objectives and start to get noticed.
Vote on the Trust Fund there
ShameOfIreland@yahoogroups.com
It is time that we all started to act and speak with one voice; I have written a letter to Brian Cowen and had no reply – am I surprised? – NO!
The Statutory Trust Fund becomes Law in September and we have little time
There are a number of “Activists” at the moment making a nuisance of themselves to the government.
We are all going of in small uncoordinated bangs and getting information to those who are willing and interested to do something are I am sure as I am feeling isolated and frustrated.
I have looked at facebook as a means and that seems ineffectual as the groups on there are somewhat inert.
I have today set up Shame Of Ireland at yahoogroups.com
I will be inviting everyone that is in my Contacts list that I can find that I feel can contribute.
I hope you will do the same?
If we all work together we can make a difference.
You can vote there on the Fund.
Regards Rob
I have looked at facebook regarding demonstrations during the Popes visit, these people have their own agenda for other reasons other than ours, I would like a protest for the survivors cause only and attended by survivors and their supporters.
Its all in the state of mind> If you think you are beaten >You Are, If you think you dare not >You Wont, If you like to win but you think YOU CAN’T , it’s almost sure you wont, If you think you loose , You’ve Lost. for out in this world you find success begins with A persons Will. Its all in the state of mind. We can make it happen together. The powers that be DEVIDED survivors up in order that they were sure to win >The Government are totally responsable for what happened to all of us as Babies and young children ,It was the State who dragged us into the Criminal Court’s to sentence and detain us in child prisons, and distroyed our childhoods TOTALLY. Mary Coughlan could never understand our continued suffering she is far to young and hasen’t a clue how badly we suffered I am sure the idea of a trust Fund was not her idea alone and should be scrapped NOW.All those so called group leaders and so called services for survivors ??????are falling over each other having been to yet another SECRET meeting to make sure the trust fund is right only for themselves for their funding and wages and a permanent job for themselves and their families, What a Farce, So bloody dishonist.
Yes I think a march in London is a great idea as their are so many of us in London it should be a great turnout.
Thanks. Anne.
Put my name down for that demonstration.
Paul.
I think it is a great idea for all of us to march in london why not they did it in ireland . for all survivors in london it is our chance to have our voices heard stand up and be counted after all we are fighting the same cause , i couldnt be there in ireland but now is my chance , take care all veronica
does anyone know what thay mean exactly by education, because if thay mean drawing lessonsor poetry reading well all i can say is that i have never felt the need for either of these subjects , but as the bard said for who could bear the whips and scorn of time , the oppressers wrong ,the proud mans contumly the pangs of dispised love ,the laws delay , and the insolence of office . this was written in the early years of the 17 century . but it fits nowadays in ireland
,
I have just read your story again Linda. It is heartbreaking and I understand you when you say you are cold towards you children. I find it hard to show emotion/hugging/kissing my kids. But they know I love them dearly.
I’m so sorry for the loss of your brother Patsy Linda. God bless him.
Paul, what you have suggested is already going ahead. It’s a fantastic idea and there is a site on Facebook now with over 10.000 people who are going to protest. There are others and they are building steadily.I will find out the names later and re-post.
Anne
a trust fund it will be … the meetings have taken place . the support groups have made decsions without us and below is what the goverment have said
In a statement issue on 15th April last, the Government indicated that it was satisfied that the arrangements put in place have benefited survivors and it does not propose to revise the arrangements.
Thanks for that Granny. I beleive the pen’s mightier than the sword. We’ve been underestimated and insulted for far to long.
We are being robbed and these people should be done for theft. Theft of our money and human rights.
Anne.
CIVIL LIBERTIES,>Irish Council of Civil Liberties, 9-13 Blackhall Place, Dublin 7.Mark Kelly International Human Rights Lawyer,,,Deirdre Duffy Barrister in Law, JOHN kennedy A Lawyer and Teacher at the >Law Society of Ireland School. E-mail info@iccl.ie Website http://www.iccl.ie fax 353-1-799 4512 , Mary Coughlan you are all about Control we are not the frightened abused children anymore we do have Intellegence and more humanity and awareness of what is the right thing to do also a sence of what real justice is .
The Religious have done their bit. They have put the money in for the Survivors. It is the Government and Ministers who are continuing to prolong our miserry.
The Government wants our money because of the mess they’re in. It’s Illegal and they know that.
One more thing. I mentioned some weeks ago that support groups have an obligation to show their records e.c.t. This is correct and will be pursued by any means by the people that will be helping me.
Oh the cans of worms……………
Anne.
Well said Granny.
Mrs Coughlan, I received a letter from Brian Cowen stating that he would send my letter to you for consideration. I have that letter. Along with others from Mary Mcaleese e.c.t. from the last two years-since I was made Homeless.
The letter stated that YOU would be in touch with me. I had to wait for three weeks and during this time, I had to ring you wasting money ringing Ireland and not one of your staff offered to ring me back, (also, bearing in mind I had initially written to Mr Cowen to ask for financial and immediate assistance because of debts and bills!) and all they did was tell me a letter’s coming out when it actually never did! I wonder if your staff have any feelings towards Survivors of child Abuse? or do they look upon us as problems that won’t go away? I was spoke to by some members of your Department like a piece of dirt and was made to feel like I was putting them out.
Lets get this straight here. I write to Mr Cowen, asking for help and to state my concerns over a “Trust Fund “..there is a glimmer of hope in the wording in the letter from him, and then I wait. Nothing. So I keep calling your Department! after MR COWEN STATED CLEARLY IN HIS LETTER THAT YOU WOULD CONTACT ME! is this some kind of sick joke? I mean, this is from ” The Irish Priminister “!!!!! and this is how lot’s of us are being treated.
By the way; I don’t know whether this is fate or what, but there was that much confusion, you know, with me having to mither your staff that certain things were explained to me that perhaps shouldn’t have been?!? like how many cases a particular person is dealing with (over 200 I was informed) presumably, Survivors who are not being Represented. This was nothing to do with Redress. I can tell you personally who the Lady was. I was even asked at one point ” can you read me the letter Mr Cowen sent “!!!!! this is absolutely scandalous!
DISPERSE THE FUNDS WHAT THE RELIGIOUS HAVE GIVEN-DO NOT GO DOWN IN HISTORY AS A MINISTER OF “EDUCATION”!!!!!….AND A WOMAN, WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR SUCH POOR AND DETRIMENTAL DECISIONS.
LOOK DEEP WITHIN AND ASK YOURSELF IS THIS RIGHT? HAVE I NOT COME INTO THIS JOB WITH PASSION AND TO DO THE RIGHT THING, OR HAVE YOU GAVE WAY TO THE PRESSURES AND LIVE IN FEAR FOR YOUR OWN JOB, HENCE DOING THE WRONG THING AND PUTTING SURVIVORS THROUGH MORE HELL?
DO YOU BELEIVE IN GOD? BECAUSE LOTS OF CATHOLICS IN IRELAND DO;BUT SADLY DO NOT PRACTISE WHAT THEY PREACH. IN FACT, I’D SAY IRELAND IS IN ONE BIG MESS AND SHOULD BE HANGING IT’S HEAD IN SHAME.
This won’t go away. There will be many names mentioned when the time is right.
It’s disgusting. All the people on Paddy’s site every day spiling their guts out. All the sly “survivors” who turned their backs on their brothers and sisters and did nothing because the pay was ok.
Christine Buckley you are SCUM! DO YOU KNOW THAT LOVE AND I’D WIPE THE FLOOR WITH YOU IF I SEEN YOU MY LOVE.
Anne.
Mrs Mary Coughlan, < Do you not realise most survivors of Industrial Reformatory's are in their 60's 70's or parhaps 80's many have passed on <What on earth are you thinking of insisting that you want to hold on to survivors rightful compansation to put into an Education Trust fund I would love to know how on earth did you come up with such a irrational unjust idea ,We survivors want closure without further collusion or secret debate's between yourself and your colleagues as to what what You want our rightful compansation for , what you are saying is Survivors will never be free of being dragged backwards to have to beg BEG to benifit from your trust fund Councelling can be had for FREE if anyone want's it and that is a big IF ,our Doctors can arrange all of that for free on the health service offered a referendum ,Your answer to that might parhaps be Group leaders were present,in that case if so called group leaders were at your meetings they must open their books and show the lists of all Names they have on their lists that they have claimed to represent to keep claiming funding they don’t represent me for one and I am many. these lists must be checked ,myself nor any member of my family’s names should not be on any list, it is our right to have this information Most of us should not be on anyone’s list ,most live in other countries most have not used nor have had any help whatsoever from any services ,small groups of survivors being held together in groups run by other damaged survivors is dangerous for their minds in a way they can never move on AND ARE HELD BACK IN THEIR CHILDHOOD HELL,so it is far better to give survivors their own compansation so our children can benefit directly from us ,Then we can move on and have some kind of closure ,>>MRS MARY COUGHLAN YOUR IDEA WILL KEEP US ALL TRAPPED IN OUR NIGHTMARE PAST IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT????IF THIS IDEA OF THE GOVERNMENT TRUST FUND DENYING VICTIMS THEIR RIGHTFUL COMPANSATION ,WILL BRING SHAME ON IRELAND.AND YOURSELF.
Linda, you couldn’t have put this any better! your absolutely right in saying the money wouldn’t change who and what we are, but it would help, and help our children.
It is an absolute insult to all our intelligence and human rights to sugggest that counselling and Education is what we need at our age! This needs to be fought all the way. I don’t think this will go ahead as there is too many fighting for the same thing. It’s also indicative of the true numbers that really go to these ” support ” groups!
I have good knowledge that already there is over 200 people who arn’t being represented who have wrote in to the Taoseach/Minister of Education e.c.t so, just how busy are these groups?!?!?!?
I beleive we shall receive the help we need. Thats my humble oppinion.
Anne
How about organising a demonstration in London when the Pope visits later this year.
We must draw attention to our plight.
R I P patsy a good guy and my best friend gone but not forgotton
How do I feel, I feel sad, I feel angry, I am not happy and never will be no matter how much money they put into a trust fund for education, welfare or counselling. Counselling does not work and never will, I was given the opportunity to have counselling at the beginning of my redress application, as was many other people and although I had been through many other counselling programs that didn’t work. I took up the offer hopping it might help in some way. But again, it didn’t, and after 6 months, the only person it helped was the councillor in boosting her bank balance to greater heights. So we all know who benefits from counselling.
Education must start at a very early age when you are a child! When your mind is free to absorb its surroundings and absorb the feelings the body experiences. That is how you learn good, bad, and right from wrong. Still as a child, you learn to read and write. Asking people late in life to be educated will only put more pressure on them causing them to slip deeper into a world that is already beyond the reached of any counselling and has been so from the first day they walked through the institutions doors as a child. Asking them to learn how to read/write and so on is like asking them to learn a completely new language and it will never work. It is too late and people cannot change just because someone has put their thoughts onto an important document saying this is how to do it
The problem is when you experience life as a child, it should be with other children, playing and exploring the world around you. Going to bed smiling and waking up with excitement and anticipation as to what you will learn and discover throughout the day. I never had that and never will, for me my childhood was over before it begun and what I was left with was only pain that is still as strong today as it was the day it began. From a very early age, I suffered at the hands of the very people who said they would take good care of me. And at the hands of other people around them who they called their friends. (You all know the story; you’ve lived it and still are). For me the pain will never leave me alone, when I go to sleep, it’s in my head and when I wake up, I can see it in the mirror. It’s a part of me that I grew up with and you cannot change me or the way I am, with counselling of education and you cannot split me into two ‘like my personality’ as one cannot survive without the other
Money will not change me or the way I feel, it will not make me happy, it cannot by you love or friendship or a family. However, like many other survivors I do have children who have suffered because of my personality and putting it nicely they deserve more than what I can give them. This is where I would get satisfaction and the benefit of the money, by making my familys life a little better. Not by trying to change what they have done to me by educating me now or by sending me to see a counsellor, the damage was done a long time ago and will stay with me until the day I die. Who knows what I might have become if I had had the chance to be my self in the beginning? A doctor, a cleaner, a mother.
The time that I spent in the institution has made me into a very complicated person and my emotions are cold. This is not human I am only waiting to die.
.
That first step through the institutions doors began a struggle that many people lost, paying the ultimate price with their lives. Some gave up the struggle while still in the institutions and others like my brother patsy gave up at the age of 26 when he could not cope with the pressures of real life and the abandonment that is felt when no one wants you because they do not understand you or think you are strange.
They may read it but they don’t care.
find out how they did things in America. you bet your arse the American government didn’t keep abuse survivors compansation.nor would they have held SECRET MEETINGS behind survivors backs. Paddy who is tracking ?????this site hope they have a good read.
Hi Peter ,I stand alongside you, I and my Family were also Insulted at the Redress by those sitting on the panel who don’t seem to know the meaning of the word REDRESS >Redress meaning> (1) REMEDY OR SET RIGHT, (2)REMEDY OR COMPANSATION FOR WRONG DOING , RESTORE EQUALITY IN A SITUATION MAKE AMENDS FOR WRONG DONE ,IE THAT IS THE JOB THEY WERE PAID HANDSOMELY TO CARRY OUT WHICH THEY FAILED TO DO >you were not effected by what happened to you in …………and in a loud voice YOU ARE EFFECTED BECAUSE YOU WERE REJECTED BY YOUR MOTHER AND YOUR FATHER WAS A DRUNK, The rest of them sniggered , THEY WERE ENJOYING INSULTING ME AND TRYING TO INTIMIDATE ME , >i could not believe what I was hearing of course that upset me so much I became speechless , NOT ONE OF THAT PANEL NOR THE RELIGIOUS HAD EVER MET MY PARENTS My file contained references from very respectable people who knew my father they gave glowing reports on my father’s good character , HARD WORKING, AN ARMY MAN,owned property, He had TRIED TO GET HIS CHILDREN OUT OF THOSE CHILD PRISONS >WHICH THE POWERS THAT BE REFUSED HIS REQUEST> even though he had an army of relatives standing by ready to help him , THE DEPT OF EDUCATION AND THE GOVERNMENT , THE COURTS BROKE THE LAW BY REFUSING MY FATHERS RIGHT TO HIS OWN CHILDREN AND HIS CHILDRENS RIGHT TO OUR FAMILY LIFE.THE GARDA USED TO COLLECT MONEY FROM HIM TO GIVE TO THE RELIGIOUS ORDER WHILE THEY STARVED BATTERED TORTURED, AND SUBJECTED HIS CHILDREN TO SLAVE LABOUR , No medical records were presented on my behalf ,which should have been I asked the useless solicitor about that he informed me that the Dept had burnt them by mistake , the so called Redress WAS set up by the very same powere in government who now hold secret meetings as to what THEY are going to do with our compansation. > IT BEGGERS BELIEF all Illegal .
I was in a home for several years along with my sisters and brothers , and the time i spent there was denied the rights to see my family I didn’t know when i would see them again , I never felt so lonely .During my time there I was sent like all the kids to family’s on the outside where I was abused and when I had to go to the redress board to tell my story the woman there told me these things happen also she said that any mental health problems after the home were hereditary , how dare she if only she knew what the home has done to my family my brother killed himself due to the horrific abuse he endured along with my family ,we find it hard to let the past go not through no fault of ours shame on you you didn’t suffer like us , and for the trust fund I totally disagree PETER
Pauline you are right.checked it out. 2 of my aunty’s were detained in GB in the early 1930′-1940’s they died young leaving young children,their daddy died fighting with the army a large family there were no social welfare in those days their poor mother went out cleaning to feed her children leaving herself hungry and sadly she died young from lack of nurishment so the children were sentenced to detention in Reformatorys, What a caring society, and a could’nt care less government and Judges .don’t start me off about the so called religious taliban. look after yourself ,there are 5 of us share this computer, great.none of us should be on any lists
Mrs Christine Buckley along with her mates in Government should be ashamed for for causing further distress to survivors How dare she attend SECRET meetings with government and religious orders about what they should do with survivors rightful compensation ,she is a traitor to those who suffered in child prisons by sucking up to and in the payroll of the very Government bodies that we survivors are trying to get justice from she has made herself a fortune ,the real survivors have been denied a voice , But then we don’t all have a multi millionaire Nigerian Daddy to advice us . The government love that.It is true that any Older survivor from the 1940’s or 1950’s who dare wish to have any say have had hostile bullying treatment on their return to their own country often after 40- 50 years in Exile so bad many fled Ireland again.leaving them traumatised and depressed. I read in a newspaper interview she Mrs B gave, > said around 1963 GB Had a nice new head nun after X left it was a different place overnight so much so she decided to stay on to go to College, I may say she is probably the only survivor from the 1940’s -1950’s who went to College 99 per cent of us never even heard the word college .if we didn’t end up in mental hospitals ,or having to flee Ireland very few survivors were left in Ireland WE DO NOT AGREE THAT OUR COMPENSATION BE TAKEN OVER AND KEPT IN A TRUST FUND KEPT AND RUN BY THE GOVERNMENT LAWYERS , WE SURVIVORS WANT OUR COMPENSATION PAID TO EACH DESERVING SURVIVOR’S OWN BANK ACCOUNT.DO THE GOVERNMENT NOW WANT THE WORLD TO KNOW NOT ONLY WERE BABIES AND YOUNG CHILDREN SENTENCED AND DETAINED IN A CRIMINAL COURT TO CHILD PRISONS >BUT NOW THEY ALSO WANT TO KEEP OUR COMPENSATION .THIS WOULD BE A CRIMINAL ACT ON THEIR PART. I do not and have NOT used any so called Services for survivors and Don’t intend to either, I want my own Compensation to do as I wish ie help my family out, have a holiday, Or Or, To those so called self appointed group leaders Get off our backs .Ps , WHY IS AVOCA HOUSE LET OUT TO Polish, Russians,other eastern European’s , where did all the funding go that Mr and Mrs Waters got in our name??????or did Mr Quinn take it back, He owned it didn’t he am I right well that’s what the man in the cafe said. ALL BOOKS FROM ALL GROUPS MUST BE OPENED TO ALL TO VIEW ON WHAT FUNDING ,WAGES , NAMES ON LISTS,WE HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW. MY NAME SHOULD NOT BE ON ANY LIST. > EXCEPT PADDY’S .PADDY YOU REALLY ARE AN ANGEL.THANK YOU.>this site is so important for survivors.The Real Ones.
There was 136, inmates in golden bridge in the 50s
Iwould love to know??WHAT DOES CHRISSY WANT A TRUST FUND FOR ,or who, whats in it for her , having met her at the redress board i did not have the feeling she cared about others as she seems to consider that she is the living proof of g b , and that she has a monoply on memories, why should she decide
Between the sneeky government and Religious advisory bodies, which are > Barristers A LAWYER ENTITLED TO REPRESENT CLINTS IN THE HIGHER COURT <NO DOUBT THEY HAD THE BEST WORKING FOR THEM IN COVERNING UP WICKED ATROCITY'S PERPETRATED WITH THE FULL KNOWLEDGE OF THE IRISH STATE THE IRISH COURTS <,GOVERNMENT DEPT'S,< DEPTARTMENT OF EDUCATION,< BISHOPS,< NSPCC,< THE GARDA <,HEADS OF CONGRATION OF ALL THE RELIGIOUS ORDERS They all knew what they were doing from the start in covering it up ,the first thing one dose is to get out of a spot is DEVIDE AND RULE is one way they think they are sure to win >PASSING THE BUCK< WHO TOpass the buck.SO IT LEAVES THE GOVERNMENT BODIES TO DO AS THEY WISH,ie now believeing THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO HOLD SURVIVORS DUE COMPANSATION TO USE HOW THEY WISH. ie INTO THE GOVERNMENTS TRUST RUN BY GOVERNMENNT LAWYERS FOR THE GOVERNMENT US MEANS SURVIVORS. >THE HIGH COURT IS THE PLACE OR BETTER STILL EUROPEAN COURT OF HUMAN RIGHTS >>>NOT THE CORUPT REDRESS BOARD.WHERE SURVIVORS ARE INSULTED AND SCARED OFF.
So they are off on their 12 week break. We really do need to do something and fast. We cannot let this crazy plan for a Trust Fund happen. An independent person/group should be brought in to handle any monies which have or will be given as reparation. Neither the government or the religous congregations should have any say in how it is dispersed….
My vote is NO FUND. GIVE TO THE VICTIMS WHAT IS RIGHTFULLY THEIRS.
Education won’t be of any use to us now. It is too late…. To any ministers or members of the religous congregations reading this.. Let us have some bit of dignity, you have already taken our childhood away… do what is right and proper, listen to YOUR VICTIMS, Come out from behind closed doors. quit speaking about and making decisions for us. We are more than capable of deciding for ourselves what is best for us. NO NO NO TOU YOUR FUND.
Granny, you are right on. The distribution of the money must be handled by the Religious Orders. Why is the government involved? Bureaucratic tieup is never going to be a solution to this situation.
As a survivor I think the government and its corrupt greed have no reason to argue where the compensation should go. It should be given to the survivors who have endured years of brutal abuse. How humiliating is it that the government is still trying to dicate where this compensation should go. Do they honestly believe after years of “education funds” and “counselling” that it benefit survivors… of course not. I for one have been turned down help from these organisations so where did the money go if it was there to help people?? I think once and for all stop giving money to these organisations and trust funds in which only they benefit with their £10,000 for birthdays and £20,000 – £25,000 for relatives funerals…and the cheek of the redress board to humilate me and call me a liar… And some survivors who were only compensated £10,000 and £15,000 for years or mental and physical abuse.. I for one do not want to go to these organisations to be refused..called names and be denied what should rightfully belong to the suffers and humilated time and time again.
Children in Goldenbridge reformatory between 1935 -1957 who worked in the rosary bead factory and Laundry to pay for the large Estate +large Manor house bought in Rathdrum by the sisters of mercy who then sold it off for millions , Where is that money , what did they do with it ?????????between 1935 -1957 how many children were in Goldenbridge ????, WHAT YEAR DID THE ROSARY BEAD FACTORY CLOSE DOWN ??
I am appealing to The Religious Orders .I know read whats on this site AND YOU are willing to make an effort to appologise to those of us who suffered as children in Religious Run Reformatory’s by way of Compansating us for our suffering and Loss, Please have the courage To Bypass the Government, Bypass Bryan Cowan and his associate’s who hold private meeting’s about how they will take total Control of Survivors compansation and how they will hold on to it in their trust fund run by their office and their Lawyers only they can then decide how they want to use Our due compansation which I find deceitful Immoral ,Corupt , Dishonist ,and a slap in the face for those of us who suffered and are still suffering that Compensation belongs to Survivors NOT THE Government Coffers .The Religious who ran those child prisons know who we are ,they would have kept files of which child was in which Reformatory and for how long as they got paid for each child by the government and Parents,or Parent.,Children who were Locked away in closed Reformatory’s were denied all Human Rights ,and even a basic education ,we were denied the chance of becoming >Lawyers, Doctors. Business Men and Women,Teachers, ect ect OUR MINDS AS YOUNG BABIES AND YOUNG CHILDREN WERE ANESTIZED THROUGH FEAR ,NEGLECT, STARVATION, BATTERY, WE WERE DENIED CONTACT WITH SIBLINGS OR FAMILY,DENIED OUR BIRTHDAYS ,DENIED OUR RIGHTFUL NAMES,DENIED OUR CHILDHOOD, DENIED OUR ROOTS,DENIED OUR RIGHT TO HEALTH CHECKS,DENIED BASIC HYGIENE, DENIED WARM CLOTHS,DENIED PROPER FITTING SHOES ,DENIED TO KNOW WHO WE ARE,DENIED ALL KNOWLEDGE OF OUR OWN COUNTRY OUTSIDE THE WALLS,AND OF OUR HISTORY,DENIED OUR HUMAN RIGHT NOT TO BE STRIPPED NAKED WHILE BEATEN WITH STICKS IN THE FREEZING COLD ,DENIED OUR DIGNITY,DENIED OUR RIGHT NOT TO BE HUMILIATED BEING FORCED TO LINE UP NAKID FREEZING BEEN BEATEN TO FORM A STRAIGHT LINE FOR THE BATH WHICH WAS FREEZING AND HAD AN INCH LAYER OF SCUM WHICH STUCK TO OUR BRUSED BODIES THEN BEING LAUGHED AT BY THE STAFF,PULLED AROUND BY THE HEAD IF WE MADE A SOUND OR CRIED OUT WITH PAIN WE WERE SENT TO THE LANDING FOR MORE PUNISHMENT . LITTLE BABY’S SENT FROM ONE BRUTAL REFORMATORY TO PLACES LIKE ARTANE ,lETTERFRACK ECT, >TO BE BRUTALLY RAPED AND BATTERED .SO ME BRIAN COWAN DO YOU STILL THINK WE SHOULD NOT RECIEVE OUR DUE COMPANSATION OR DO YOU STILL BELIEVE YOU SHOULD HAVE CONTROL OF THE MONEY????? i WILL BE HERE.
I feel so sad for all survivors still having to fight on. Fight for help they so despearately need, when really this should have been standard. Remember, we are talking about the most vulnerable members of society. As children, our lives were wrecked and controlled, by no fault of our own. And then we endured years of hell, hunger-constant hunger..I was ALWAY’S HUNGRY!..
I remember watching those Ministers/mp’s in The Dail, live on RTE and thinking, well surely if those in power, these honourable people are saying this, then there’s no need to worry? surely not!…. I mean, it would be illegal for people in those positions to make such statements (Recorded, witnessed)
I do beleive firmly, that this fight will go on and further than expected. I also beleive that there is one thing we gained from the paths we walked, and that is fire, enough fire to fight on. I think there is an undercurrent at this moment. I would never underestimate a survivor and their capabilities to acheive justice.
Take care all.
Anne
WE NEED A POWERFUL HONEST MINISTER TO MAKE A STAND FOR US, IS THERE SUCH A PERSON IN IRISH POLITICS ?
lets remember those famous words in the dail and Oireachtas ON RTE
WE MUST HEAR, UNDERSTAND, SUPPORT THESE PEOPLE WHO’S CHILDHOOD HAVE BEEN TAKEN AWAY AND DESTROYED THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN.
WE NEED THAT MINISTER NOW WHO IS IT?
it is wrong so wrong that survivors like caroline have to suffer like this i only hope someone does something soon for survivors who are just locked out from any direct most urgent support they obviously need now not three years in the future.
I would like to say that a trust fund wont do anything to help me with my situation im in at the moment or in the future, i live in temporary accommadition and struggle every day to survive no ammount ofschooling or councelling is going to help me in the near future so as far as im concerned i dont want any trust fund thats my vote .
I always say that these cases should be taken up to the European Courts, Human Rights, Strasburg or The Hague.
Now, when I hear these people in high places, Government, Law Representatives, Politicians and Catholic Church Officials responding (or rather, NOT) to the demands of the Victims, and surely aware of their needs and precarious circumstances, I can only think of N U R E M B E R G.
These intelligent men and women in high office and responsible positions, are JUST AS GUILTY AS THE CRIMINALS / PAEDOPHILES / ABUSERS……etc, foot-soldiers of our society.
Police in Belgium….. Courts in America….. Pope’s Visit in England….. NUREMBERG NUREMBERG NUREMBERG NUREMBERG HERE I COME !
what shocked me once was when the mr Barry’s voice once said as he was listening to our conversation before we decided to go to redress. we were talking about our experiences in the schools.
when it was mentioned of being in five industrial schools of hell he turned and said you cannot claim for being in five schools, just that you were in the schools. one claim and that is what is on the table.
HE WAS RIGHT
“( HE AGREED THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS WITH THE RELIGIOUS AND GOVERNMENT, THIS IS WHY IT WAS NOT ON THE CATEGORY OF TYPES OF ABUSE )”.
please tell me minister if you were sent to prison at three years old
transferred to another prison for abuse
transferred to another prison for abuse
transferred to another prison for abuse
transferred to another prison for abuse
then thrown out into the streets for even more abuse for many years to come
now say you are over fifty years old and of ill health would you minister expect to trust these people who claim to represent you but have/are making deals behind your back/given money/given funds
is this not the very same kind of trust funds/deals/monies the religious had back then?
with your hand on your heart would you be very happy?
YOU KNOW AS A MINISTER THIS IS NOT RIGHT AT ALL IT IS A COMPLETE REPEAT OF THE PAST BUT WORSE BECAUSE WE WERE TRICKED INTO THE WORTHLESS REDRESS. SOME PEOPLE GOT ONLY EQUIVALENT TO A COMPENSATION FOR SOMEONE TRIPPING OVER A BRUSH AND SPRAINING THEIR ANKLE. AND ALL WAS SORTED OUT BEFORE THE RYAN REPORT.
BUT NOW THAT THE RYAN REPORT HAS COME OUT IN THE LATER PART OF REDRESS PAYMENTS HAS THIS GOT ANY EFFECT ON THE DECISIONS FOR THE LATER REDRESS PAYMENTS ?
COS AS IT WAS SAID NO ONE KNEW HOW BAD THE ABUSE WAS UNTIL THE RYAN REPORT CAME OUT.
I JUST WONDER OR SHOULD THE LATER CLAIMENTS TO BE SO LUCKY?
THE RYAN REPORT V REDRESS = WHAT IS THE ANSWER
Just a thought Paddy. How about you e-mail all what’s on this site to those unreasonable people who call themselves a government? what does everyone think of this idea.??
THANKS PADDY FOR THE WEBSITES, I WILL
FOLLOW UP.AS THE OMBUDSMAN WANT THE HSE
TO EXPLAIN THEIR HANDLING OF FUNDS
EVERYONE SHOULD COMPLAIN TO HER THE WAY
FUNDS FOR US ABUSED ARE BEEN HANDLED
BY BARRY AND BUCKLEY AND CO. THE EMAIL
ADDRESS IS, “OMBUDSMAN@OMBUDSMAN.GOV.IE”
seanie your not alone friend best wishes to you and i couldnt have said it better . seems we all have a lot in common
a trust fund right and wot gud will yhat do the likes of me a 41 year old wit no skills or trade and very littel education liveing here in kerry in a 2 bedroom flat 3 weeks behind in rent and not noing the minitute im going 2 become homeless again i spent 2 and a half years in a hellwhole from the age of twelve 2 15 and the rest of my life from that point homeless r in sum other form of hellwhole and now im am sum bit happy and a peace whit d world for the first time in my life and true no fault of my own i faceing the prospect of being homeless again while the so called goverment and all these other groups say they r doing wot is best 4 me well let me tell u this i spent 30years of my life trying 2 get the littel peace that i have now so let me ask u this minister wot good is a trus fund 2 me if im dead r homeless r in prision after 30years of living like an animal on yhe streets r in insitutions of the state so no thank you very much minister keep ur fund and just tell me this who can i turn 2 now in my time of need.and 1 more thing i would like 2 take this oppertunity 2 say thank u mr doyle if it wer not for u and ur site i would no nothing at all u are the only person that seems 2 care about the pepol so again thank u very much 4 all the information mr doyle
The only advice I can give is to suggest that people write to ALL parties (all parties have agreed to this Statutory Fund/Trust Fund. You will find the name of all members of the various political parties on their websites. Fianna Fail http://www.fiannafail.ie http://www.finegael.ie, http://www.labour.ie Searching through the sites will give the email addresses of various people you might choose to write to. I hope this is of some help. Paddy.
HEAR WE GO AGAIN,MARY COUGHLANS STATMENT
AGAIN TELLS US THAT THE GOVERNMENT ALREADY
HAS ITS MIND MADE UP.
THEY RAM THEIR TRUST FUND DOWN OUR THROATS
OUR FEELINGS OUR OPINIONS AND OUR SUFFERINGS
DO NOT MATTER TO THEM.
WHERE ARE OUR OUR REPS! LAUGHING ALL THE WAY TO THE BANK,COULD NOT ONE OF THEM STAND UP
AND GIVE OUR FEELINGS ON THIS DAYLIGHT
ROBBERY,
THE ONLY WAY WE CAN GET JUSTICE IS BY TAKING
OUR CASE TO EUROPE. DO WE HAVE ANY SURVIVORS
WITH THE EDUCATION AND KNOWHOW TO START THE
LEGAL PROCEDURE,
WHILE WE ARE ARGUING AMONG OURSELVES WE ARE WAISTING PRECIOUS TIME
ONCE COWANS PROPOSAL IS PASSED WHEN THE DAIL
REOPENS AFTER THE SUMMER BREAK WE CAN KISS
JUSTICE GOODBYE.
PADDY COULD YOU ADVISE ON THIS MATTER.
Dear Paddy and all,
I have e-mailed the Irish Times editor and await the reply from them. Everyone else should do the same, If it comes to exposing traitors in our midst, “GROUPS” that say they represent us, then I will gladly do so, Ministers who speak out of the side of their mouths, then I will also, did you read what this Minister said, I am shattered, FAIR AND RESONABLE AWARDS, how dare she, my God, Fair, reasonable, and then call it an award or maybe a “reward”, our lives were destroyed as children, wake up Minister Coughlan, I, we are the tears of Irelands past, the children placed in the dungeons of her deepest sadistic religious torture chambers, will you walk a mile in my shoes, Miss Minister ?. tell me then that I received a Fair and reasonable award from the Religious orders. Sit at this computer day after day for what seems like an eternity, listening and reliving the agonys of my fellow survivors accounts entwined with my own, tears streaming down my face at age 75, I am ashamed to admit that, but then that is reasonable and fair, it is my award from Ireland.
Thank you Miss Minister.
Seanie.
Mary Coughlan, et al, speaks (“thinks”) as if she and her die-hard Irish Catholic comrades are not also the childhood victims of the Roman Catholic dogma – aka TYRANNY – that has ruled our country for the past century, at least. That’s how f*****d-up her psyche is!
The lunatics who run this country of ours – and have been doing so since they formed the so-called Free State – are nothing but a bunch of psychopaths.
Anyone looking for justice from the Irish “government” is delusional…
Seanie. I’m not sure if there will be any other meetings with the Taoiseach and other government Ministers. I’m happy to relay anything you want relayed to Mr. Cowan. Thank you for your trust in me, I appreciate that. Paddy.
What a pathetic excuse, they dont have access to out details …..Ok folks, let’s waste no more time. how about each one of us send our details to Brian Cowan/ Minister Coughlan along with our views on their idea of a trust fund and also about just how fair and reasonable our redress was.
Again the Irish goverment has betrayed the survivors, (what more did we expect)they have taken millions of Euros and created a slush fund for any victim support group. Perhaps i will start a group in South East London, in the hope they will send me umpteen thousands of lovely Euros without having to keep accounts or be accountable.
Thanks Paddy for your efforts on our behalf.
Paul.
Paddy,
I have the e-mail address of the Irish Times and will see if I may be able to draw the attention of the editor at lettersed@irishtimes.com, maybe the e-mail from the Minister and the existence of your site and VIEWS of all of us as regards to the FUNDS thing would bring others who are not connected yet to the fore to express what we desire regarding all these Groups and the compensation package.
The Minister Mary Coughlan TD should be aware that the writer of the last letter, myself, is a CII. Certified International Investigator, ACFE, Associate Certified Fraud Examiner, for many years.
Regards.
Seanie.
in reply to finding out what the survivors want , i for one dont care for educational funds . I am 41 years old and dont wan to go back to school ,i work hard and pay my way in my view any money should go to the survivors so they can better their lives , i know it would help my family for the better. why cant we use this site to have our views heard . as far as trust funds go , trust begins with doing the right thing on behalf of all the survivors thanks for the update paddy veronica
Patrick Doyle,
With your permission exclusively, I would appreciate your acceptance of my association with “The God Squad Survivors Group” to be my represenative in any and all correspondence, discussions, meetings and articles with the Minister of Education & Skills, Minister, Mary Coughlan TD.
As I am not affiliated with any Groups that are at present meeting with the present Government and it’s Ministers in discussing what they should do with my compensation from the Church. I give you full permission to advise the said Minister of my address, e-mail address,the lawyers who represented me, and any other information that I will supply to you instantly. My view as I am sure will be the view of the majority of survivors who are still alive worldwide,will be, not to set up any Fund, my question to the Minister; Minister, what should I expect from a Statutary Fund at age 75 now, I have all lifes skills under my belt, educated myself at my own expence over the years, what use is any compensation, which the Church has alloted to me, going to do sitting in a bank earning interest which could amount to approx two million Euro,s a year on the deposit of 100 million, “approximately”. When I die which I think is not too distant, do I give my wife, children, grandchildren and great grandchildren a will that instructs the holders of my compensation permission to allow them access to some Statutary Fund in a far off land from whence I escaped the brutality of the Church and irrisponsible Government of the day ?. Would you enlighten me please Minister Mary Coughlan TD.
My VIEW (VOTE) is NO to any FUNDS, period.
Kind Regards,
Yours Sincerely,
Seanie Morrison,CII.ACFE
11330 Lakeside Drive,
Prince George,
British Columbia,
Canada. V2K 5M6.
e-mail; sas@pgonline.com
Paddy, thank you for helping to disperse any miss understandings both intentional and unintentional that have been put forward to the frustration of many. At least we have in the ministers statement what can be the embryo to a dialog based on factual information. Of interest is the side stepping and divertment of 348.51 million euro.
First of all Iwould like to thank this lady for the information, but i would like to say many of us live in different parts of the world . explaining our stories is the best way to get ignored, we have no way of getting jobs,All i want now is to live in two rooms and be able to pay my bills . get to know my family and be able to at least offer them a couch to sleep on . having to leave our country is bad enough . inside of me i will always be from goldenbridge. people accuse me of beeing here for the welfare . if i tell them i escaped from an industriel school in ireland thay dont believe me . all i need is to be treated as someone who can be respected. i dont want to feel numbered. these services can only be used by people in ireland , in ten years of existance these groups have become exclusive clubs where we wouldnt dare go . beeing excluded dous not HEAL
no one gives a toss…as far as it gos with me they can keep the lot…ive better things to do with my life than begging them lot for pennies …..
by the way paddy thank you for this minister’s response, we should be thankful we can get all such information in one place your drive doing this work is to be admired.
though we all feel sad, unhappy, often angry with the way of how we feel let down by all government, religious and groups. it is something worth taking the time to think the kind of dedication you have toward informing survivors.
regards robert.
you know something ladies and gentlemen this is so hard to swallow. we have waited a near whole lifetime to speak of our pain. nearly a whole lifetime its as if we went in as children/babies and came out old men and women with very bad experiences of this life.
its no good asking anything, like the childhood we had, we are turned down regarding welfare with the words appealing/begging unsuccessful due to …….
how many more older survivors will pass away before they see anything different, three years is a long time especially during a rescission.