The Irish Times – Saturday, April 3, 2010
ALISON HEALY
The deaths and disappearances of children and teenagers while in church-run residential care or psychiatric institutions will be highlighted at a rally outside the Dáil later this month.
The Templemore Forgotten Victims Group has asked all abuse survivors to attend the event at noon on April 15th.
Dr Rosaleen Rogers, chairwoman of Templemore Forgotten Victims, said “countless” children had died or disappeared while held in mental hospitals and church facilities, “and survivors want to know their fate and hold those guilty accountable”.
While the Ryan report into institutional abuse has documented a number of deaths in institutional care, there is no overall estimate of the number of deaths.
Dr Rogers said protesters would be demanding prosecution of those responsible for such deaths.
Alan Shatter said sorry to the Irish so called `deserters` who left Ireland in thousands to join the British Army. What about the girls like me who were starved under that awful Starvation Order in the Emergency. To starve a new baby and then Jail my father for stealing food to feed me made him a victim too. No right thinking person would allow this – Ireland says no to abortion – No to family planning but said Yes to starving the girls in the families where relatives left for the British Army…I demand recognition and redress now Dr R Rogers
What “happened” in 1942, at letterfrack, that the christian brother`s should just “close” the cemetery.?? Why were children buried in “various spot`s” in unconsecrated ground.?
Will parish record`s establish which priest`s officated at such burial`s in Letterfrack.?
If the numbers of bodies found at “various locations” around letterfrack do not tally with what Gibson states then he has some explaining to do. The crux is to how to find ALL the bodies. That is the only way to get through the smoke screen carefully laid out with the help of legal coaching by that order. What step next?.
And hopefully that this question is not killed again and that this time a move is made to bring it right into the public domain and further.Yes there is the possibility of requesting help from the European mainland. There is technology to locate human remains even after this time lapse. Amnesty could be one step forward.
Paddy, You have a point that there is sufficient discrepancies as to the body count at Letterfrack as to warrant the police being given notice. Manix Flynn has a few things to say about the hidden graves around Letterfrack. Angry seems to have his act together. I don’t know what happened in Letterfrack as I was never there, therefore I can so far not make allegations based on facts but there is something worrying about this episode that lives it’s own life. What I am doing is lifting the question so as to breathe some life into it. Angry seems to have done just that.
Thank you angry for your letter about Letterfrack. My brother was in there for eight years. It could easily have been him buried in them grounds the things they did to him. The Pope talked the other day about being intimidated. WHAT ABOUT US. We were only children, were we not intimidated by the nuns and brothers. to do there bidding.i am feeling quiet sick looking at HIS HOLINESS knowing what he knew about child abuse cover-up.GET YOUR CHEQUEBOOK OUT YOUR HOLINESS AND PAY THE IRISH SURVIVORS OF INSTITUTIONAL ABUSE.FURTHER SUBSTANTIAL COMPENSATION AS PROMISED.and let us live out the rest of our lives in PEACE.
Surely to whatever God their might be, all of this information should be passed to the Irish Police and let them investigate the matter. That has to be the next move. Otherwise what is being written here by various contributors could be seen as them not bringing such serious allegations to the attention of the Irish/British or whatever countries, police forces. Paddy.
Quote from the christian brother David Gibson. “””””””””””””In Letterfrack between 1891 and 1942, 74 boys were buried in the cemetery there. Between 1896 and 1970, 26 more boys died and were buried at various locations. The statement continued: “Some died in hospital, some in the care of employers to whom they had been sent from Letterfrack, and others while at their own homes. The deaths and causes of death were recorded in all cases.” Unquote………The above being from an article by Patsy Mc Garry in the Irish Times of November 5th, 2002.
Up to 1942, as Gibson states, SEVENTY FOUR CHILDREN were buried in the “cemetery proper”. In 1935, a child was buried some FIVE HUNDRED METRE`S from the cemetery proper. This child`s grave was uncovered some few year`s ago by his brother, who wished to know why this particular burial had not taken place in the “cemetery proper”, STILL active in 1935.?????
Gibson contend`s that 100 children died !AT! Letterfrack. In 2002, the figure`s of death`s occuring at Letterfrack were changing on a weekly basis as Gibson was compelled to make “trawl`s” of his record`s concerning these death`s. He Gibson, held to HIS figure of SEVENTY FOUR children being interred in the “cemetery proper”. So WHY this one burial in 1935 NOT taking place in the “cemetery proper”.? Would`nt that make the cemetery number`s SEVENTY THREE , and not SEVENTY FOUR.?
Between 1896-1970, Gibson states that TWENTY SIX boys died, some at home, some on holiday, some working as slave labour for “farmer`s”.
Gibson`s figure`s are decidedly dodgy in regard to these TWENTY SIX children. Of the children who died at home, is Gibson stating that these children were returned to Letterfrack for burial.? Of those dying in hospital, were these children returned to Letterfrack for burial.? We do not know the date`s of these TWENTY SIX deaths occuring OUTSIDE of Letterfrack, how many of them occured BEFORE 1942, which would have seen them buried in the “cemetery proper”, and how many died AFTER 1942, which would have seen them buried “elsewhere” in Letterfrack, as Gibson state`s, in “”various location`s””.?
Of these ONE HUNDRED children, we do NOT know how many of them were orphans, without kith or kin.
On many occasions, Gibson has been asked to supply information on these burials at Letterfrack, in particular with regard to ANY PARENT`S of these unfortunate children being in attendance at ANY of these burials, or indeed ANY relative`s at all, witnessing such burials.
There are MANY unexplained anomalies regarding these deaths of children at the notorious Letterfrack, and taking Gibson`s PUBLIC STATEMENT of ONE HUNDRED CHILDREN DYING !! AT !! Letterfrack, it create`s a problem, in that of the SEVENTY FOUR children interred in the ” cemetery proper”, it cannot be accepted as the TRUE FIGURE when compared against what is being claimed by Gibson in relation to the deaths in Letterfrack concerning his summary of 1891-1942, which in essence covers the “legal” period of the “cemetery proper”, but fails to address WHERE in Letterfrack between 1896-1970, the UNKNOWN NUMBER of the TWENTY SIX children who were actually “RETURNED” to Letterfrack for burial, are interred.? As Gibson claim`s, these children are buried in “various location`s” around Letterfrack.. HOW WOULD HE KNOW THAT.? IS HE, OR HIS ORDER IN POSSESSION OF RECORDS WHICH STATE, “””OH, WE BURIED THIS CHILD IN SUCH AND SUCH A PLACE TODAY”””.?
There are MANY, MANY unexplained deaths of children which occured in these brutal hell holes. Those who SHOULD be advancing the cause for a PROPER FULL BLOODED POLICE INVESTIGATION into these matters, are so busily engaged IN KISSING THE bishops RING THAT THEY CANNOT SEE THE “”WOOD”” FOR THE MONEY. BOTTOM FEEDERS, ALL OF THEM.
I am asking that Colm O’Gorman from Amnesty International takes a real hard look at this question of the murder of children at “church facilities” by relegious orders. Justice Ryan skimmed over the issiue and Gibson was well prepared for any questions by his legal eagles. Yes the ones who cost the Irish Tax payers 40 million euro.
This is the one question that the Irsh Christian Brothers do not want the spot light shone on. Letterfrack would be a suitable beginning.